To: Oliver Kurland
From:  Thomas Moorfield
Sent: Wednesday 8:30pm

> > You know, at some point we're going to have to stop saying 'I barely
> > know you' and other sentences in that family.
>
> Yeah. :-)  Now works for me.

Deal ;)

> And I won't tell you I got up to check my e-mail at four in the morning.
> Just in case you got an early start to your day.

Oliver - you forget - I'm a student. I don't *do* early starts without a
really good reason. I can be up and here for 8 if I have to, but
realistically, it's more like 11 or 12.

> Good point.  Warning though--you ask me, I'll tell you, most likely.  I
> tend to just answer questions and worry about whether the person really wanted
> to know later.  Or not at all.  It's a fault.

We all have them - I think I can manage with that one though.

> Okay, off to the bookstore on my way home.  And yeah, it *is* a cunning
> disguise.  My brilliant plan to make you think I didn't know what you were
> talking about has worked!

A cunning double bluff ;)

> You think I'm attractive?

Did you look in a mirror recently?  Yes. Which probably has at least as much
to do with the way you talk, and your hands as what you see in the mirror.

> > Sounds - very smart. [slate green? slate's grey unless there's something
> > really messed up with my colour vision]
>
> Slate green is like grey slate with a bit of green mixed in.  Just sounds
> better than grey/green.  Or so the guy who sold me the suit said.

Fair enough.

> > and an antique shirt?
>
> Oh dear, we really are out of sinc with the clothes, aren't we?  That's
> antique white--sort of a really pale cream, just barely off white.  Janet
> insists it's actually ecru, but I haven't got any idea what that is.

Um - you'll have noticed by now that the finer points of good dressing escape
me?  Good good.

> > I'm afraid I can't compete.  Fleece [grey with navy], T-shirt [I think
> > that might once have been a 'no fear' logo - sort of blue-ish], jeans [faded not
> > ripped] and very battered knock-off Nikes.
>
> Sounds far far more comfortable than my suit.  And it suits you better
> than the suit does me.

Never seen you not-suited for comparison, have I?  I imagine it was fairly
apparent that I wasn’t exactly at ease wearing mine. I figure eventually
I'll get used to it, but I'm not sure if it'll ever be me.

> It's just clothes.  :-)  We're all naked under them.
>
> Oh man, I didn't just say that did I?  I'm not going to delete it
> either--that's just how my mind works.

Which should embarrass you why? Except that, for no real reason, it's put
that 'discovery channel' song in my head. [I forgot my headphones today, so
I'm stuck with whatever my brain wants to hum at me]

> Yeah.  I mean, okay.  I can do that.  I don't think I could go back to
> small talk anyway--sort of crossed a line somewhere.  We can work with this.

I think so.

> Okay, maybe icky.  I'm a closet dork.  I like baroque.  Really.  And David
> Bowie from the 70's.  Punk bands that everyone has heard of--no time to go
> out and find the ones no one's heard of--and the folk stuff my dad used to
> play.

Play like in a band? I've a fondness for Celtic-y folk stuff - I know
"Irish" pubs are trendy at the moment, but I've always liked the sort of
songs that go with a fiddle and bodhran. There's a couple of pubs round here
that have the odd night of live music in that vain, which is always fun,
mostly trad, with one guy who writes his own songs, which just crack me up.

I kind of skipped punk and went straight to grunge as a teenager, which
looks really odd on the cd rack along side the ambient electronica. [I like
my music layered and mood enhancing, and my songs angry and angsty,
apparently - can’t remember who said that to me, but it's pretty close to
the mark]

> *falls over laughing at the thought of voting Republican*

At the risk of being contentious - and in full desire for an answer - what
are your political leanings?

> Really?  How does it work in England?

It's just - less formal, I guess. Just hooking up with friends of friends,
going out as part of a group ... and I don't think I'd say 'Oh, I'm dating
so and so' - it'd be 'I'm seeing' or 'I'm going out with'. "A Date" just
sounds very - American high school prom.  I tell you, it threw me completely
when Kay asked me out - like, officially asked me if I'd date him.  I guess I
was expecting it more to go along the lines of talk all night, naturally run
into each other the next day and do whatever, and somewhere down the line
let the 'boyfriend' label slip in there.  I don’t know - maybe having a sort
of formal framework makes things easier?

> Your turn--bacon butty?  Brown sauce?

I guess it's not the sort of thing they serve up in posh hotels - and I
don’t think I found decent bacon the whole time I was in Albuquerque, so I
have no idea if you have the right ingredients to play along at home.  It's
just several juicy fried rashers, hot, in a sandwich - and it has to be
cheap white bread, and real butter, with the bacon grease soaking in. It's a
real greasy-spoon cafe thing - with a cup of strong milky tea. Some people
have it with ketchup [philistines] and others with brown sauce - um - HP
Sauce? I think 'daddy's' is a UK brand. Sort of fruity and spicy and
vinegar-y - I guess a little like a purified chutney? I’m making a real hash
of describing it.  When you come over, I'll demonstrate.

> *mind stutters around mounted police*....ever seen the uniforms for the
> mounted police in Canada?  uhn.

ohhh yeah. Mmmhmm.

> And I cooked it in the oven.  Just....for a little too long.  Shut up.  In
> my defence, I was being helped by several friends, and there was liberal
> use of brandy.  Uh, in us, not the lamb.  There was also something about the
> oven mitts.  Right, moving on...

I'm not smiling. At all. Nope.

> I'd like to.  But no, there isn't really. I could drive to the parks
> easily enough, but it just seems...not right.  I'll think about it.  I'm not here
> so much, and it snows so much in the winter that I probably wouldn't get
> out as often as I'd like either.

Something is better than nothing?  Driving to get to a park to ride does
seem  kind of weird, but if that’s what it takes to get to ride -
presumably you drive to the gym?

> I thought that was pretty open.  I saved your CV for no reason other than
> that I wanted to.  If you want even more open, I saved your CV 'cause I
> kept thinking about you, that day, that night.  I saved your CV 'cause I didn't
> want to trash it.
>
> I e-mailed you, 'cause you climb.  Wasn't doing a scary stalker thing, had
> no idea you're gay.  Didn't know we'd get along as well as we do.
>
> I'm glad I did.  Save it, and e-mail you.

Likewise. And I hadn't really thought about the scary stalker angle -
although it crossed my mind that, yeah, of course you know where I live -
and my junior school, and all that other CV-stuff, which felt a bit weird
for a moment..

> Nah, had deli at nine, then at eleven thirty we ordered out for Chinese.
> Got home past two, de stressed for a bit, check my e-mail at four, slept,
> got up and was back here by nine.  Early night tonight, I think.

Jeeze - they need to give you a break! - you must be asleep on your feet. I
thought you were meant to be sleeping, keeping the Tyler at bay, anyway ;)

What on earth are you working on that's forcing those hours on you? I'm
assuming you don’t *have* essay deadlines.

> > Working on it, cap'n.  How'd you work your way up to your post at your
> > tender years anyway - I mean, you're what? Five years out of school?
>
> Yeah, five.  But I spent all my summers doing the programs--spent a summer
> in Costa Rica, one in Israel with my dad (at a commune), two in Guatemala.
> Did the work I'm training people for now, saw if from the other end.  Took
> marketing in school, coupled it with an anthropology minor so I could
> learn about cultures, and sort of slipped in and did what needed doing.

Cool. I guess that's where summers spent doing industrial temp stuff doesn’t
do anything for my CV, or my 'what do I want to do' question. Except I
absolutely do not want to end up packing cheese for a living. *gag* Or in
fact, working anywhere where I have regular contact with a production line
in a hand's on capacity.  What were you doing in Guatemala that was so cool
you went back?

> If it helps, communicating this way makes it way harder to get into
> someone's head.  No nuance, no body language, no tone of voice.  I won't
> try to go where you don't want me.

S'ok - I just operate mostly in a state of blissful ignorance of my own
inner workings, so it's kind of weird to realise that some people can see
stuff I didn't even realise was there, you know? So long as you share your
conclusions, that's cool. I think I pretty much trust you not to be trying to
mess with my head, use your powers for evil.

> That's just it.  You are one of my friends.  And you're the one I wanted
> to tell.  So I did, and now I'm going to just go with the whole 'stop beating
> yourself up about it' thing.

Good, and well, good.

> I honestly don't know.  Really.  Sometimes I think that the reason I'm not
> with someone is 'cause I'm just too damn scared to go looking.  Then
> something like that happens and I remember why I'm scared of the clubs and
> the bars and shit like that.  It's a vicious circle.

Sounds pretty reasonable to me - you don't want to be with someone you'd
pick up as a one night stand in some club, so you don't go looking there.  I
am so not the person to tell you otherwise. I'm what, 45 mins on the tube
away from Old Compton Street, and do I go up there, go clubbing, meet guys?
Nope. It just seems so - alien - somehow, what's the point?  Maybe if I'd
actually made friends with people in the GLB, it would be different - even if
I still hated most of the music and the whole meat market aspect, if I knew
some people who fitted in there, maybe it would make more sense.

God - sorry - that just turned into a total 'all about me' tangent. whack me
if I do that - it's a bad habit.

> And now Janet's all keen to set me up with this guy from Portland
> again--he's supposed to be in town next week.  Yay.  So not impressed with
> this idea either.

Janet's your colleague? That sounds a little stressful - a blind date with
someone you sort-of work with? I mean - do you know the guy at all?

> > What's the joke, gay men have sex without relationships, and lesbians
> > have relationships without sex? I'd kind of like to believe that *wasn't*
> > true.
>
> It's not.  If I remember correctly anyway.  :

Why, I never knew you were a lesbian ;P

> > If I hadn't been in a 'must find job and not slit wrists' sort of
> > headspace, and you hadn't been a potential employer that'd pretty much
> > have been my thought process. You're not hard on the eye, let us say.
>
> Really?  Wow.  Umm...now I'm the speechless one.

Go role reversal!

> You and I will get better.  Good things will happen, we'll find people who
> treat us right, with respect.
>
> Who are sexy as fuck and do whatever it is that makes our toes curl.  With
> respect.

Amen.

> > Sometimes it might be easier to be a kid again - this whole adult world
> > thing is kinda scary, and I don't know if I'm ready yet - and that's
> > just jobs and houses and stuff.
>
> That feeling?  Growing up.  I'll let you know if it ever goes away.

Gee - thanks.

Still?

'Cos you *look* like you know what you're doing, where your going, all that
good stuff.

> It was pretty bad when we first broke up--we'd been living together our entire time
> here, had made friends together; no one in our group knew what he was doing, and
> while they freely admit he was wrong they all say they can sympathise with what he
> was feeling, 'cause I was gone so much.

God - that's just. Jesus, Oliver - he wasn’t happy he could have *said*
something.

> Okay, I'm going to stop, 'cause I can't see anyway that he should be able
> to get off scott free and you taking the blame for everything.  And I don't
> want to piss you off by saying over and over that he brought it on
> himself.

I don't know.  It takes two to make it, right?  I've been giving this some
thought, these last few days. Not just what I could have done to make it
different, but, yeah, maybe there was things he could have done, too. Which
is a little scary, 'cos at the time? I pretty much thought he was perfect,
and - it's hard to make myself see that he wasn't.  But I’ve got to take
responsibility for *my* actions, and it was me that sent the boulder down
that set of the avalanche, you know?  And - if it was me that messed up,
then maybe next time I can *not* mess up, and it won't happen again.  Which
now I look at it on the screen sounds kinda dumb. But I'm still thinking it.

> Yeah, well.  Peter cried when I kicked his naked ass out of here and he
> caused that.  Tried to tell me that it was my fault he was fucking some
> guy in our bed.  And you know what?  It wasn't.  He came into this with his
> eyes open and it was his choices that led to me saying enough.

You know what? I'm not getting the best of impressions of Peter. That's -
that's low, and maybe I'd have let him grab some clothes, but - if you
didn't punch either of them, I'm impressed.

Which makes me sound like a total thug. I'm not - really - I've actually
never hit anyone in my life, just - I can imagine losing it all together if
something like that happened.

> Kay made his choices.  And yeah, he got hurt, but it was ultimately his
> choices that hurt him, not any intent of yours.  Did you intend to out him
> when you picked up the phone?  No.  Did you intend to make his life hard?
> No.

No, but I did it anyway, didn't I?

> > > Not.  Your.  Fault.
> >
> > Wish I could believe that.
>
> Try. You deserve to be with someone who's proud to be with you--proud
> enough not to pretend to be someone he isn't.

It's not *just* my fault is it - takes two to tango - and he could have, I
don't know - hell - he could have stood up to his parents, or tried to
straighten things out, or - something. I fucked up, but he could have
fucking tried.

I'm sorry.

> Christ, maybe.  I never went.  And I'm not saying the right things here, I
> know.  I know closeted guys and they seem to be live their lives well
> enough...I just don't get how someone can be happy when they can't be
> honest with themselves and the people who are important to them.  It's colouring
> what I'm saying.

Thing is, you have a point. I mean telling my parents wasn’t exactly a fun
happy thing, but - I am who I am, and they deserve to know that, right? Same
goes for anyone else I'm close too - I don’t exactly carry a placard, but why
the hell *should* I have to hide?

> Not sure I did any good.  But I'm here if you want to throw more at me.

Um yeah. You want I start with the chocolate cream pies or something
that'll actually taste good when thrown?

> Make you a deal.  We start talking about stuff that you don't want anyone
> to read, switch to rkurls at pdc.com

I just don't want to get you fired by talking to you - if anyone can be
bothered to look through the server logs, they're welcome.

*waves to the techies*

I'll bare it in mind though, should I get the burning desire to send you
something really x rated ....

I'm trying and failing to think of a reason why I would.

> Get to work.  *stern look*

Aye aye cap’n.

I got a decent amount done today - first two chapters written and
referenced. Go me.  Going to finish up here, and then head for home, where
I'm re-reading The Scarlet Letter - the excitement!

I hate to ask when you're so flat out, but did you have time to shove
together anything on the skilled migrants thing? Tell me to stop being a
brat if I'm pushing.

> After we climb something.  :-)

Oh yeah - climb stuff *then* die - plan.

Take care, and hope you get the chance to sleep soon

Tom
*********
Remember : You are not a salmon.



To: Thomas Moorfield
From: Oliver Kurland
Sent: Thursday 09:05am

Morning, Tom.  Or, afternoon, I guess.

> > And I won't tell you I got up to check my e-mail at four in the morning.
> > Just in case you got an early start to your day.
>
> Oliver - you forget - I'm a student. I don't *do* early starts without a
> really good reason. I can be up and here for 8 if I have to, but
> realistically, it's more like 11 or 12.

Lucky lucky you.  God, I feel like crap today, late nights catching up.
Think I'll try to take tomorrow off and just sleep.

> > You think I'm attractive?
>
> Did you look in a mirror recently?  Yes. Which probably has at
> least as much to do with the way you talk, and your hands as
> what you see in the mirror.

Okay, that made my morning better.  :-)  My hands?  Really?

> > Oh dear, we really are out of sinc with the clothes, aren't we?  That's
> > antique white--sort of a really pale cream, just barely off
> > white.  Janet insists it's actually ecru, but I haven't got any idea
> > what that is.
>
> Um - you'll have noticed by now that the finer points of good
> dressing escape me?  Good good.

:-)  I don't really get it either--just managed to find a sales guy I trust
to tell me what looks good.  Still prefer jeans to anything, really.
However, if I have to wear the damn thing I'd like something that looks
reasonably okay.

> > Sounds far far more comfortable than my suit.  And it suits you better
> > than the suit does me.
>
> Never seen you not-suited for comparison, have I?  I imagine it was fairly
> apparent that I wasn’t exactly at ease wearing mine. I figure eventually
> I'll get used to it, but I'm not sure if it'll ever be me.

You looked good.  Relaxed.  Unselfconscious.  And I'll stop now before you
start thinking I'm far too strange to be real.

> > It's just clothes.  :-)  We're all naked under them.
> >
> > Oh man, I didn't just say that did I?  I'm not going to delete it
> > either--that's just how my mind works.
>
> Which should embarrass you why? Except that, for no real reason, it's put
> that 'discovery channel' song in my head. [I forgot my headphones
> today, so I'm stuck with whatever my brain wants to hum at me]

LOL about the theme song.

I guess I'm just....sometimes I think I spend too much time thinking about
you.  And it concerns me a little when I say stuff that could be seen as
suggestive, 'cause I'm not real sure how it comes off.

> > Okay, maybe icky.  I'm a closet dork.  I like baroque.  Really.
> > And David Bowie from the 70's.  Punk bands that everyone has heard
> > of--no time to go out and find the ones no one's heard of--and the folk stuff
> > my dad used to play.
>
> Play like in a band?

Sort of.  He can pick out stuff on a guitar pretty well, and has a nice
voice.  Between him picking stuff out and the records he'd play--I think I
was the only kid in school who's father made it a point to get his record
player serviced so he wouldn't ever have to buy a CD player--I grew up with
a lot of folk stuff.  Celtic, Gordon Lightfoot, Joan Baez, Leonard Cohen,
Judy Collins, Peter, Paul and Mary...that sort of thing.

>  I've a fondness for Celtic-y folk stuff - I know "Irish" pubs are trendy
> at the moment, but I've always liked the sort of songs that go with a
> fiddle and bodhran. There's a couple of pubs round here that have the
> odd night of live music in that vain, which is always fun, mostly trad,
> with one guy who writes his own songs, which just crack me up.

I like that stuff.  :-)  There's some great bands coming off the east coast,
has been for years now.  Celtic has really taken off here.  And Boston?
Mostly Irish, so we get it all.

> I kind of skipped punk and went straight to grunge as a teenager, which
> looks really odd on the cd rack along side the ambient electronica. [I
> like my music layered and mood enhancing, and my songs angry and
> angsty, apparently - can’t remember who said that to me, but it's pretty
> close to the mark]

Honestly, I don’t listen to music much.  I mean I'll play it low for
background when I'm doing stuff around the apartment, but if I'm reading or
talking I want it off.  I can't work with it on either, so no radio in the
office.

I'm hopelessly out of touch with whatever is current.

> > *falls over laughing at the thought of voting Republican*
>
> At the risk of being contentious - and in full desire for an answer - what
> are your political leanings?

Extremely liberal.  All for separation of church and state, keeping the
state out of the personal lives of people, civil liberties must be
protected, gay marriage should be legal, so should pot so it can be
regulated, a woman has the right to choose, and we need more money for
social welfare.  Stop using my tax money for weapons, get the hell out of
foreign government, and spread the wealth.

Ahem.  You asked. ;-)

> > Really?  How does it work in England?
>
> It's just - less formal, I guess. just hooking up with friends of friends,
> going out as part of a group ... and I don't think I'd say 'Oh, I'm dating
> so and so' - it’d be 'I'm seeing' or 'I'm going out with'. "A Date" just
> sounds very - American high school prom.  I tell you, it threw me
> completely when Kay asked me out - like, officially asked me if I'd date
> him.  I guess I was expecting it more to go along the lines of talk all night,
> naturally run into each other the next day and do whatever, and somewhere
> down the line let the 'boyfriend' label slip in there.  I don’t know - maybe
> having a sort of formal framework makes things easier?

Easier in some ways, I expect.  If a guy asks you out you know 1) he's
interested 2) he's not gonna tell you half way through dinner that he's
straight and 3) he likes you enough to spend hours screwing up the courage
to ask you out in the first place.

Harder 'cause sometimes you say yes to a date and the next thing you know
you're a couple, and you haven't really had the chance to really get to know
the guy.

> > Your turn--bacon butty?  Brown sauce?
>
> I guess it's not the sort of thing they serve up in posh hotels - and I
> don’t think I found decent bacon the whole time I was in Albuquerque, so I
> have no idea if you have the right ingredients to play along at
> home.  It's just several juicy fried rashers, hot, in a sandwich - and it
> has to be cheap white bread, and real butter, with the bacon grease soaking
> in. It's a real greasy-spoon cafe thing - with a cup of strong milky tea.
> Some people have it with ketchup [philistines] and others with brown sauce - um - HP
> Sauce? I think 'daddy's' is a UK brand. Sort of fruity and spicy and
> vinegar-y - I guess a little like a purified chutney? I’m making a
> real hash of describing it.  When you come over, I'll demonstrate.

Gottcha on the brown sauce.  It sounds like something you'd reach for after
a night out.  :-)

> > And I cooked it in the oven.  Just....for a little too long.
> > Shut up.  In my defence, I was being helped by several friends, and
> > there was liberal use of brandy.  Uh, in us, not the lamb.  There was also something
> > about the oven mitts.  Right, moving on...
>
> I'm not smiling. At all. Nope.

Twerp.  You're setting yourself up to cook for me, you know.

> Something is better than nothing?  Driving to get to a park to ride does
> seem  kind of weird, but if that’s what it takes to get to ride -
> presumably you drive to the gym?

Very good point.

> > I e-mailed you, 'cause you climb.  Wasn't doing a scary stalker
> > thing, had no idea you're gay.  Didn't know we'd get along as well as we
> > do.
> >
> > I'm glad I did.  Save it, and e-mail you.
>
> Likewise. And I hadn't really thought about the scary stalker angle -
> although it crossed my mind that, yeah, of course you know where I live -
> and my junior school, and all that other CV-stuff, which felt a bit weird
> for a moment..

If it helps, remember I had to take another look to see what you're
studying.  :P  I didn't memorize it.  ;-)

> > Nah, had deli at nine, then at eleven thirty we ordered out for Chinese.
> > Got home past two, de stressed for a bit, check my e-mail at
> > four, slept, got up and was back here by nine.  Early night tonight, I
> > think.
>
> Jeeze - they need to give you a break! - you must be asleep on
> your feet. I thought you were meant to be sleeping, keeping the Tyler at
> bay, anyway ;)

Nah, I'm okay.   Feeling better the more coffee I drink.  Can you translate
'keeping the Tyler at bay' for me?

> What on earth are you working on that's forcing those hours on you? I'm
> assuming you don’t *have* essay deadlines.

No essays, just trying to rework the program within the new budget.  I hate
money.

> Cool. I guess that's where summers spent doing industrial temp
> stuff doesn’t do anything for my CV, or my 'what do I want to do'
> question. Except I absolutely do not want to end up packing cheese for a living. *gag*
> Or in fact, working anywhere where I have regular contact with a production line
> in a hand's on capacity.  What were you doing in Guatemala that
> was so cool you went back?

The first summer was spent building housing after a big storm, getting fresh
water pumped in.  The second was building a hospital and helping to set up a
school library--that one I did both labour and harassing people for money
and books.

And please.  Stay away from packing cheese for a living.  Sounds deadly
dull.

> > If it helps, communicating this way makes it way harder to get into
> > someone's head.  No nuance, no body language, no tone of voice.  I won't
> > try to go where you don't want me.
>
> S'ok - I just operate mostly in a state of blissful ignorance of my own
> inner workings, so it's kind of weird to realise that some people can see
> stuff I didn't even realise was there, you know? So long as you share your
> conclusions, that's cool. I think I pretty much trust you not to
> be trying to mess with my head, use your powers for evil.

Sure thing.  Evil impulses are in check.

> > I honestly don't know.  Really.  Sometimes I think that the
> > reason I'm not with someone is 'cause I'm just too damn scared to go
> > looking.  Then something like that happens and I remember why I'm scared of
> > the clubs and the bars and shit like that.  It's a vicious circle.
>
> Sounds pretty reasonable to me - you don't want to be with someone you'd
> pick up as a one night stand in some club, so you don't go
> looking there.  I am so not the person to tell you otherwise. I'm what, 45
> mins on the tube away from Old Compton Street, and do I go up there, go clubbing,
> meet guys? nope. It just seems so - alien - somehow, what's the point?
> Maybe if I'd actually made friends with people in the GLB, it would be different
> - even if I still hated most of the music and the whole meat market
> aspect, if I knew some people who fitted in there, maybe it would make more sense.
>
> God - sorry - that just turned into a total 'all about me' tangent. whack me if I
> do that - it's a bad habit.

I don't mind.  It's how we're getting to know each other, yeah?  And I
agree, for what it's worth.  I go into clubs and places like that and I just
feel lost.  I don't know what to do or say, and it just makes me feel more
alone because I want to talk, not scream over the music.  How can you get to
know someone when there's light flashing and conversation is reduced to
music I know nothing about?

> > And now Janet's all keen to set me up with this guy from Portland
> > again--he's supposed to be in town next week.  Yay.  So not
> > impressed with this idea either.
>
> Janet's your colleague? That sounds a little stressful - a blind
> date with someone you sort-of work with? I mean - do you know the guy at
> all?

Nope, never met him.  Janet's cool though--we know each other pretty well.
Unfortunately, when I ask what he's like, all I get is 'He's cute, he has a
good job, and he's gay."

Which could mean anything.

> > > What's the joke, gay men have sex without relationships, and lesbians
> > > have relationships without sex? I'd kind of like to believe that
> > > *wasn't* true.
> >
> > It's not.  If I remember correctly anyway.  :
>
> Why, I never knew you were a lesbian ;p

Twerp.  :P

> > That feeling?  Growing up.  I'll let you know if it ever goes away.
>
> Gee - thanks.
>
> Still?

Yep, still.  Sorry.  :P

> 'Cos you *look* like you know what you're doing, where your
> going, all that good stuff.

Not sure what to say here, so I'll just go with 'Thanks" :-)

> > It was pretty bad when we first broke up--we'd been living together
> > our entire time here, had made friends together; no one in our group
> > knew what he was doing, and while they freely admit he was wrong
> > they all say they can sympathise with what he was feeling, 'cause I
> > was gone so much.
>
> God - that's just. Jesus, Oliver - he wasn’t happy he could have *said*
> something.

Well, that's what I thought too.  He told the guy he was sleeping with that
I was like a roommate.  The guy thought he meant I *was* a roommate, and was
completely confused when I went off on them.  He thought I was some creepy
roommate looking for a show.  Peter was just speechless when I walked in,
and it just.....

I'm sorry, I can't talk about this right now.

> I don't know.  It takes two to make it, right?  I've been giving this some
> thought, these last few days. Not just what I could have done to make it
> different, but, yeah, maybe there was things he could have done, too. Which
> is a little scary, 'cos at the time? I pretty much thought he was perfect,
> and - it's hard to make myself see that he wasn't.

That's rough.  Seeing without blinders is always a little scary.

> But I’ve got to take responsibility for *my* actions, and it was me that sent the
> boulder down that set of the avalanche, you know?  And - if it was me that messed up,
> then maybe next time I can *not* mess up, and it won't happen
> again.  Which now I look at it on the screen sounds kinda dumb. But I'm
> still thinking it.

It's not dumb.  Learning from mistakes is how you grow.  I still don't think
you made a huge mistake though.

> > Yeah, well.  Peter cried when I kicked his naked ass out of here and he
> > caused that.  Tried to tell me that it was my fault he was fucking some
> > guy in our bed.  And you know what?  It wasn't.  He came into this with
> > his eyes open and it was his choices that led to me saying enough.
>
> You know what? I'm not getting the best of impressions of Peter. That's -
> that's low, and maybe I'd have let him grab some clothes, but - if you
> didn't punch either of them, I'm impressed.

I couldn't see straight.  He left, they left--and I'm pretty sure they
managed to find something to put on, but I wasn't there to see it.  I was
puking in the bathroom.

> Which makes me sound like a total thug. I'm not - really - I've actually
> never hit anyone in my life, just - I can imagine losing it all
> together if something like that happened.

I lost it, and I'm pretty glad I'm not a violent person--I was just lost; if
I had the impulse to hit him I'm not sure I would have stopped.

> > Kay made his choices.  And yeah, he got hurt, but it was ultimately his
> > choices that hurt him, not any intent of yours.  Did you intend
> > to out him when you picked up the phone?  No.  Did you intend to make
> > his life hard? No.
>
> No, but I did it anyway, didn't I?

But it goes to intent, Tom.  You didn't mean to hurt him.  Cut yourself a
little slack.  You're obviously sorry he was so hurt, and you got hurt too,
when he turned you away.  You can't keep blaming yourself, taking it all on
you.

> It's not *just* my fault is it - takes two to tango - and he could have, I
> don't know - hell - he could have stood up to his parents, or tried to
> straighten things out, or - something. I fucked up, but he could have
> fucking tried.

Yeah, he could have tried. That's what I've been trying to say.

> I'm sorry.

Don't be.  I'm sorry you're hurting, sorry you went through that.  Sorry you
couldn't have been with someone who'd treat you right.

But you will be.

> Thing is, you have a point. I mean telling my parents wasn’t exactly a fun
> happy thing, but - I am who I am, and they deserve to know that,
> right? Same goes for anyone else I'm close too - I don’t exactly carry a
> placard, but why the hell *should* I have to hide?

Exactly.

> > Not sure I did any good.  But I'm here if you want to throw more at me.
>
> Um yeah. You want I start with the chocolate cream pies or something
> that'll actually taste good when thrown?

Depends on if we're going to eat it after it's all smooshed.  :-)

> I just don't want to get you fired by talking to you - if anyone can be
> bothered to look through the server logs, they're welcome.
>
> *waves to the techies*
>
> I'll bare it in mind though, should I get the burning desire to send you
> something really x rated ....
>
> I'm trying and failing to think of a reason why I would.

What, I'm not good enough for your x-rated stuff? ;-)  :P

> I got a decent amount done today - first two chapters written and
> referenced. Go me.  Going to finish up here, and then head for home, where
> I'm re-reading The Scarlet Letter - the excitement!

Woooo!  I have a day of boredom, followed by an evening of boredom.  Lucky
me.

> I hate to ask when you're so flat out, but did you have time to shove
> together anything on the skilled migrants thing? Tell me to stop being a
> brat if I'm pushing.

Been gathering links and doc files in spare moments--I'll send an attachment
and you let me know if you need more, okay?

Take care,

Oliver

***ATT: Tom1.txt***



To : Oliver Kurland
From : Thomas Moorfield
Sent: Thursday 3.46pm

And good afternoon to you, good sir ;)

Many many thanks for the links and so forth - some really good stuff there -
you're a star. Anything I can do as a thank you?

> Lucky lucky you.  God, I feel like crap today, late nights catching up.

*offers up a large coffee in consolation*  [I'd better ask how you take it -
or do you go for the froofy chocolate and steamed milk stuff?]

> Okay, that made my morning better.  :-)  My hands?  Really?

Really. I notice hands - it's a thing - and you have lovely, strong hands,
and you take care of them, and use them well when you're talking - and if
I'm sounding like the scary stalker would you tell me?

> However, if I have to wear the damn thing I'd like something that looks
> reasonably okay.

You were beating your own expectations then ;)

> You looked good.  Relaxed.  Unselfconscious.  And I'll stop now before you
> start thinking I'm far too strange to be real.

But no stranger than one might expect from an evil overlord in disguise, of
course ;)

I looked relaxed? Maybe I should go in for acting work.  Actually, I think
By the time I got round to your stall I'd pretty much given up all hope, which
is oddly freeing.

> I guess I'm just....sometimes I think I spend too much time thinking about
> you.  And it concerns me a little when I say stuff that could be seen as
> suggestive, 'cause I'm not real sure how it comes off.

You spend a whole lot of time thinking about me *naked*? Or - ok yeah,
that's a little weird, if that is what you meant - or that's what you were worried
I'd think? I was pretty much assuming it was a general thing - you
know - people are people, and clothes are just extras.

> > Play like in a band?
>
> Sort of.

Cool ;)

> I think I was the only kid in school who's father made it a point to get his record
> player serviced so he wouldn't ever have to buy a CD player

I know a couple of guys who DJ who are vinyl nuts, but - I never even *had*
a record player. Went straight from tape to cd.

> I like that stuff.  :-)  There's some great bands coming off the east
> coast, has been for years now.  Celtic has really taken off here.  And Boston?
> Mostly Irish, so we get it all.

Cool - do you play?

> Honestly, I don’t listen to music much.  I mean I'll play it low for
> background when I'm doing stuff around the apartment, but if I'm reading
> or talking I want it off.  I can't work with it on either, so no radio in the
> office.

I'm so used to working with someone else's music going, it feels kind of
weird not to have anything going on in the background. And sometimes I have
the need to sing along - which is pretty much cruel and unusual punishment
for those around me, I think.

> Extremely liberal.  All for separation of church and state, keeping the
> state out of the personal lives of people, civil liberties must be
> protected, gay marriage should be legal, so should pot so it can be
> regulated, a woman has the right to choose, and we need more money for
> social welfare.  Stop using my tax money for weapons, get the hell out of
> foreign government, and spread the wealth.
>
> Ahem.  You asked. ;-)

*phew* - so it is safe to keep talking to you after all ;)

Unless that’s a cover for your totalitarian evil overlord manifesto?

> Easier in some ways, I expect.  If a guy asks you out you know 1) he's
> interested 2) he's not gonna tell you half way through dinner that he's
> straight and 3) he likes you enough to spend hours screwing up the courage
> to ask you out in the first place.
>
> Harder 'cause sometimes you say yes to a date and the next thing you know
> you're a couple, and you haven't really had the chance to really get to know
> the guy.

My extensive worldly wisdom leads me to suspect there is no 'simple' when it
comes to relationships and stuff. #3 is a pretty strong argument though  -
so long as you’re the kind of guy who *gets* asked.

> Gottcha on the brown sauce.  It sounds like something you'd reach for
> after a night out.  :-)

Hangovers require the full English - most definitely cooked by someone else.

> Twerp.  You're setting yourself up to cook for me, you know.

Umm - In this kitchen? With the other two around? Because believe me, they
cottoned on *way* quick that I cook better than half the local takeaways and
the pair of them are gannets. A fact I should maybe use more often to get
them to clean up after themselves, perhaps.  Otherwise - yeah I'd cook for
you - I like cooking, and it's a pain for just one. Which is why I'm having
chocolate for lunch *again* - at this rate I should just give up and declare
myself a pot bellied pig until after finals are over....

> If it helps, remember I had to take another look to see what you're
> studying.  :P  I didn't memorise it.  ;-)

So I have an absent minded stalker? That's oddly reassuring ;)

> > Jeeze - they need to give you a break! - you must be asleep on
> > your feet. I thought you were meant to be sleeping, keeping the Tyler at
> > bay, anyway ;)
>
> Nah, I'm okay.   Feeling better the more coffee I drink.  Can you
> translate 'keeping the Tyler at bay' for me?

Tyler Durden? Fight Club? Me trying a little too hard with the in jokes,
apparently. Sorry.

> No essays, just trying to rework the program within the new budget.  I
> hate money.

Lack of it is the cause of a lot of problems, yes.

> The first summer was spent building housing after a big storm, getting
> fresh water pumped in.  The second was building a hospital and helping to set up
> a school library--that one I did both labour and harassing people for money
> and books.

Anyone ever tell you, you are one good guy? For a bloke in a suit, you
really put your money where your mouth is on the heart stuff.

> And please.  Stay away from packing cheese for a living.  Sounds deadly
> dull.

It's dull, it stinks [literally] and you'll never want to buy pre-packed
cheese ever again.

> Sure thing.  Evil impulses are in check.

Riiiight. ;P

> > > And now Janet's all keen to set me up with this guy from Portland
> > > again--he's supposed to be in town next week.  Yay.  So not
> > > impressed with this idea either.
> >
> > Janet's your colleague? That sounds a little stressful - a blind
> > date with someone you sort-of work with? I mean - do you know the guy at
> > all?
>
> Nope, never met him.  Janet's cool though--we know each other pretty well.
> Unfortunately, when I ask what he's like, all I get is 'He's cute, he has a
> good job, and he's gay."
>
> Which could mean anything.

You going to let yourself be set up anyhow? I mean maybe he actually *is*
cute and interesting and looking for Mr Right? ‘He has a good job' just
sounds like something a 50's mum would say ;) - hell - maybe my mum would
calm down if I found a cute doctor to take home. You think that might work?

I talked to her again last night - [for a split second I missed having the
terrible twins around - normally she can't get through because they're using
the phone all evening] - and I think I've managed to get her to believe that
I *don't* have aids, and that I'm being careful. [apparently it's beyond the
realm of possibility that I'm being as careful as, in fact, I am, but I
shall accept the slur on my moral character if it means she'll stop
panicking]

> I couldn't see straight.  He left, they left--and I'm pretty sure they
> managed to find something to put on, but I wasn't there to see it.  I was
> puking in the bathroom.

Christ. OK - if you were telling me this in person? I figure it would be at
*least* a three pint conversation - possibly more - and that would mean that
I'd have a good excuse for wrapping an arm around your neck and giving you a
sort-of-hug and swearing to track him down and beat him to death with a
haddock.

> I'm sorry, I can't talk about this right now.

Sorry - didn't mean to push.  Subject dropped.

> That's rough.  Seeing without blinders is always a little scary

Got to do it sometime, right?

> It's not dumb.  Learning from mistakes is how you grow.  I still don't
> think you made a huge mistake though.

It's more that, frankly, its a bit terrifying to think that it wasn't all my
fault, because that means that I can't stop it happening again. And I *know*
that's totally illogical. I can just see Becka giving me the raised eyebrow
nod thing if I said any such thing to her ...  I'm - I'm working on it.

> You can't keep blaming yourself, taking it all on you.

See above.

>  Sorry you couldn't have been with someone who'd treat you right.
>
> But you will be.

*repeat the 'good things - good people - are going to happen for both of us'
mantra*

Did I say thank you? For asking, and listening, and not just telling me to
grow up and get over myself? Because - thank you.

Becka - who's also doing American Studies and is about the only person who I
saw over there and over here - she’s taking most of the same options as me,
which is most of what we have in common - she knows that there was someone -
a guy - and that it went pear shaped and messed me up, and  - I think she
knows Kay's name, but that's about it. No one else here even knows that
there *was* a Kay. I think you were probably right, that I needed to tell
someone, get it out of my head where I could look at it from a different
angle. [And I only spent two nights pacing and screaming inside with a
bottle of vodka and the mix tape he made me for company, which I wasn't
going to tell you, but in the interests of the honesty thing I'm not going
to delete. Compared to how I was even 6 months ago, this is progress.]

> > I'll bare it in mind though, should I get the burning desire to send you
> > something really x rated ....
> >
> > I'm trying and failing to think of a reason why I would.
>
> What, I'm not good enough for your x-rated stuff? ;-)  :P

*What* x-rated stuff? You know something I don't?

> Woooo!  I have a day of boredom, followed by an evening of boredom.  Lucky
> me.

You sound just thrilled to be you today. ;(  - Get some sleep?  World's not
*so* bleak is it? At least not at the other end of a 12 hour kip.

I'd offer increasingly random suggestions of things to do, but : go to sleep
kind of takes the top ten places in any list.

[Nick Hornby moment : top ten films to watch when you're bored? ]

Take care - talk soon?

Tom
*********
Remember : You are not a salmon.


***Week Four***


To:  Thomas Moorfield
From: Oliver Kurland
Sent: Friday 02:54am

Morning--I *know* it's morning there, 'cause it's the middle of the night
here.

Left work at three, came home and fell asleep, and now....well, here I am.
Wide awake and wondering if it's safe to eat a real meal at three in the
morning.

> Many many thanks for the links and so forth - some really good
> stuff there - you're a star. Anything I can do as a thank you?

If I think of anything I'll let you know.  Give you the second set of master
plans for World domination?

> *offers up a large coffee in consolation*  [I'd better ask how
> you take it - or do you go for the froofy chocolate and steamed milk
> stuff?]

Coffee is supposed to come in a nice plain mug with a bit of milk and one
sugar.  Black in a pinch.  No topping, no flavouring, no sprinkles.

Oliver has Spoken.

Man, it's weird being up at this hour.  The whole building is silent.  It's
raining and I can hear every time a car drives by--I'm on the fourth floor,
so that's a big deal.  Usually I hear people and an general hum of
background.  I can see the streetlights reflecting back off the windows
opposite mine, and I can see a man in the next building, sleeping on his
couch in front of the TV.

Which means people can see in here and I'm going to close the curtains.

Huh.  Apparently I ramble in the early hours.  Who knew?

> > Okay, that made my morning better.  :-)  My hands?  Really?
>
> Really. I notice hands - it's a thing - and you have lovely,
> strong hands, and you take care of them, and use them well when you're
> talking - and if I'm sounding like the scary stalker would you tell me?

I'd tell you.  Right now I'm just feeling flattered that you noticed
anything about me.

We did manage to have a conversation right?  In between what must have been
the most subtle give and take of checking each other out?  I know we did,
'cause I liked your accent, your tone of voice.

> > However, if I have to wear the damn thing I'd like something that looks
> > reasonably okay.
>
> You were beating your own expectations then ;)

Now I'm grinning.  :D

> > You looked good.  Relaxed.  Unselfconscious.  And I'll stop now
> > before you start thinking I'm far too strange to be real.
>
> But no stranger than one might expect from an evil overlord in
> disguise, of course ;)

We must always keep my ultimate goal in mind.  I shall rule the world and
you can either be my slave or by my side.

Which sounded far better in my head.  Moving on.

> I looked relaxed? Maybe I should go in for acting work.  Actually, I think
> by the time I got round to your stall I'd pretty much given up all hope, which
> is oddly freeing.

Could be.  :-)  You were friendly and asked good questions and were polite
even though you weren't interested in a job.  You still wanted to know about
the programs, and you...well, you didn't just rush off.  You looked at me
when you spoke.

> > I guess I'm just....sometimes I think I spend too much time
> > thinking about you.  And it concerns me a little when I say stuff that
> > could be seen as suggestive, 'cause I'm not real sure how it comes off.
>
> You spend a whole lot of time thinking about me *naked*? Or - ok yeah,
> that's a little weird, if that is what you meant - or that's what you
> were worried I'd think?

That's what I was worried you would think.  I think.  God, I was so tired
I'm not sure what I meant anymore---which still leaves you wondering what
the hell I meant, now that I've got it all tangled.

I don't spend a whole lot of time thinking about you naked.  Or while I'm
naked.

Uh, that just looks odd, so I'm going to move on again.

No, I'm not.  Because that comes real close to either playing mind games or
being dishonest, and I said I wouldn't do that.  I don't spend *a lot* of
time thinking about you naked, but I have.

And I'll totally get it if I don't hear from you again, though I wouldn't be
happy with myself.

Now, moving on and hoping to God that you didn't just faint or die or
something leaving the e-mail open where the  next person to the computer
will read that.

> I was pretty much assuming it was a general thing - you
> know - people are people, and clothes are just extras.

That's mostly what I meant!

Yay, one of us has a working brain.

> I know a couple of guys who DJ who are vinyl nuts, but - I never
> even *had* a record player. Went straight from tape to cd.

So did I--wasn't allowed near Dad's--it was *his* thing, you know?

> > I like that stuff.  :-)  There's some great bands coming off the east
> > coast, has been for years now.  Celtic has really taken off here.  And
> > Boston? Mostly Irish, so we get it all.
>
> Cool - do you play?

Nope, not a musical bone in my body.  :-)

> > Extremely liberal.  All for separation of church and state, keeping the
> > state out of the personal lives of people, civil liberties must be
> > protected, gay marriage should be legal, so should pot so it can be
> > regulated, a woman has the right to choose, and we need more money for
> > social welfare.  Stop using my tax money for weapons, get the
> > hell out of foreign government, and spread the wealth.
> >
> > Ahem.  You asked. ;-)
>
> *phew* - so it is safe to keep talking to you after all ;)
>
> Unless that’s a cover for your totalitarian evil overlord manifesto?

Too late.  Guilt by association--you fell into my trap and will share the
blame when I'm in charge of the world.

> > Easier in some ways, I expect.  If a guy asks you out you know 1) he's
> > interested 2) he's not gonna tell you half way through dinner that he's
> > straight and 3) he likes you enough to spend hours screwing up
> > the courage to ask you out in the first place.
> >
> My extensive worldly wisdom leads me to suspect there is no
> 'simple' when it comes to relationships and stuff. #3 is a pretty strong
> argument though  - so long as you’re the kind of guy who *gets* asked.

True and true.  It seems to take a lot to work of the courage to ask for
even a simple dinner date.

> > Gottcha on the brown sauce.  It sounds like something you'd reach for
> > after a night out.  :-)
>
> Hangovers require the full English - most definitely cooked by
> someone else.

Actually that sounds great, even at three am--I'm starving.  Wonder what I
have in the fridge?

Lettuce, a bottle of Coke, two of water, and something in a plastic
container that I'm not too sure about.  Huh.  Time to shop.

> > Twerp.  You're setting yourself up to cook for me, you know.
>
> Umm - In this kitchen? With the other two around? Because believe me, they
> cottoned on *way* quick that I cook better than half the local
> takeaways and the pair of them are gannets. A fact I should maybe use more
> often to get them to clean up after themselves, perhaps.  Otherwise - yeah I'd cook for
> you - I like cooking, and it's a pain for just one. Which is why
> I'm having chocolate for lunch *again* - at this rate I should just give
> up and declare myself a pot bellied pig until after finals are over....

I'm sure you'll be fine--cycle. But please eat something healthy.  Yes, I
see the irony.

> > If it helps, remember I had to take another look to see what you're
> > studying.  :P  I didn't memorise it.  ;-)
>
> So I have an absent minded stalker? That's oddly reassuring ;)

LOL! It's all in the plan.  Page three.

> > Nah, I'm okay.   Feeling better the more coffee I drink.  Can you
> > translate 'keeping the Tyler at bay' for me?
>
> Tyler Durden? Fight Club? Me trying a little too hard with the in jokes,
> apparently. Sorry.

Nah, that was just me being tired and missing the reference.  ;-)  I promise
to do better.  :P

> > The first summer was spent building housing after a big storm, getting
> > fresh water pumped in.  The second was building a hospital and
> > helping to set up a school library--that one I did both labour and
> > harassing people for money and books.
>
> Anyone ever tell you, you are one good guy? For a bloke in a suit, you
> really put your money where your mouth is on the heart stuff.

My dad's influence.  But thank you.  :-)

> > Sure thing.  Evil impulses are in check.
>
> Riiiight. ;P

Hmm.  My evil aura seems to be a little stronger than I had thought.  I'll
work on that too.

> > Nope, never met him.  Janet's cool though--we know each other
> > pretty well. Unfortunately, when I ask what he's like, all I get is 'He's
> > cute, he has a good job, and he's gay."
> >
> > Which could mean anything.
>
> You going to let yourself be set up anyhow? I mean maybe he actually *is*
> cute and interesting and looking for Mr Right? ‘He has a good job' just
> sounds like something a 50's mum would say ;) - hell - maybe my mum would
> calm down if I found a cute doctor to take home. You think that
> might work?

Maybe.  Who knows with mothers?  ;-)  And yeah, I guess I'm meeting him
Monday night--Janet's getting a bunch of people together for supper at a
place near work, which as far as I can tell is just an obvious attempt to
get us in the same room.  At least it's not a solo thing and I can bail
early if I have to.

> I talked to her again last night - [for a split second I missed having the
> terrible twins around - normally she can't get through because
> they're using the phone all evening] - and I think I've managed to get her to
> believe that I *don't* have aids, and that I'm being careful. [apparently it's
> beyond the realm of possibility that I'm being as careful as, in fact, I am, but I
> shall accept the slur on my moral character if it means she'll stop
> panicking]

Glad you talked to her and managed to get some of it sorted.  Really.

> > I couldn't see straight.  He left, they left--and I'm pretty sure they
> > managed to find something to put on, but I wasn't there to see
> > it.  I was puking in the bathroom.
>
> Christ. OK - if you were telling me this in person? I figure it would be at
> *least* a three pint conversation - possibly more - and that would mean
> that I'd have a good excuse for wrapping an arm around your neck and
> giving you a sort-of-hug and swearing to track him down and beat him to
> death with a haddock.

Again, it was me being too tired and getting too wrapped up in it.  Sleep is
a wonderful thing.  And I wouldn't have said no to a sort of hug.  :-)

> > I'm sorry, I can't talk about this right now.
>
> Sorry - didn't mean to push.  Subject dropped.

You didn't push.  It's okay, really.  I'm okay.

> > It's not dumb.  Learning from mistakes is how you grow.  I still don't
> > think you made a huge mistake though.
>
> It's more that, frankly, its a bit terrifying to think that it wasn't all my fault,
> because that means that I can't stop it happening again. And I *know*
> that's totally illogical. I can just see Becka giving me the raised eyebrow
> nod thing if I said any such thing to her ...  I'm - I'm working on it.

It....well, it can happen again.  There's no guarantees, right?  But you'll
have your eyes open, and you'll know.  But hopefully, it *won't* happen
again.

> Did I say thank you? For asking, and listening, and not just telling me to
> grow up and get over myself? Because - thank you.

You're welcome.  And I'm here to listen and tell you the truth anytime you
need it.

> Becka - who's also doing American Studies and is about the only
> person who I saw over there and over here - she’s taking most of the same
> options as me, which is most of what we have in common - she knows that
> there was someone - a guy - and that it went pear shaped and messed me up,
> and  - I think she knows Kay's name, but that's about it. No one else here even knows
> that there *was* a Kay. I think you were probably right, that I needed to tell
> someone, get it out of my head where I could look at it from a different
> angle. [And I only spent two nights pacing and screaming inside with a
> bottle of vodka and the mix tape he made me for company, which I wasn't
> going to tell you, but in the interests of the honesty thing I'm not going
> to delete. Compared to how I was even 6 months ago, this is progress.]

Okay, now there's where I would have offered the sort of hug.  I'm sorry
you're hurting, Tom.  Wish I could make it better.

> > > I'll bare it in mind though, should I get the burning desire
> > > to send you something really x rated ....
> > >
> > > I'm trying and failing to think of a reason why I would.
> >
> > What, I'm not good enough for your x-rated stuff? ;-)  :P
>
> *What* x-rated stuff? You know something I don't?

There are times in every man's life when an imagination is a wonderful
thing.  Or a curse.  Take your pick.

> > Woooo!  I have a day of boredom, followed by an evening of
> > boredom.  Lucky me.
>
> You sound just thrilled to be you today. ;(  - Get some sleep?

Turned out to be a day of boredom followed by a looooooooong sleep. :P

> World's not *so* bleak is it? At least not at the other end of a 12 hour kip.

You know it!  Feeling very perky right now.  Too bad the rest of the world
is asleep.

> [Nick Hornby moment : top ten films to watch when you're bored? ]

1) X-men
2) Men in Black
3) Shakespeare in Love
4) The Princess Bride
5) True Lies
6) Ladyhawk
7) Dial M for Murder
8) The Maltese Falcon
9) Rope
10) Silence of the Lambs.

Not in order.  You?

> Take care - talk soon?

I'm here.

Have a good day, Tom.

Oliver



To : Oliver Kurland
From :  Thomas Moorfield
Sent: Friday 10:54am

> Left work at three, came home and fell asleep, and now....well, here I am.
> Wide awake and wondering if it's safe to eat a real meal at three in the
> morning.

Glad they let you go and get some sleep - how one earth are you expected to
juggle budgets on 3 hours?

> If I think of anything I'll let you know.  Give you the second set of master
> plans for World domination?

Umm - If they're your plans??? And I don’t have the super powers to steal
them either. Sorry.

> Coffee is supposed to come in a nice plain mug with a bit of milk and one
> sugar.  Black in a pinch.  No topping, no flavouring, no sprinkles.
>
> Oliver has Spoken.

And thus the world Shall Be.

It's definitely not meant to be this powdery crap in a paper cup, but :
vending machine - I'll take what I can get.  It's before noon, it's still
the holidays and I'm back at my station, plugging on with the dissertation.
Go me.

> Man, it's weird being up at this hour.  The whole building is silent. It's
> raining and I can hear every time a car drives by--I'm on the fourth floor,
> so that's a big deal.  Usually I hear people and an general hum of
> background.  I can see the streetlights reflecting back off the windows
> opposite mine, and I can see a man in the next building, sleeping on his
> couch in front of the TV.
>
> Which means people can see in here and I'm going to close the curtains.
>
> Huh.  Apparently I ramble in the early hours.  Who knew?

Champagne and early mornings - check   Sounds pretty cool - the 'having the
whole world to yourself' thing.

> I'd tell you.  Right now I'm just feeling flattered that you noticed
> anything about me.

I noticed that - noticed the way you present stuff you know backwards and
sideways, and the way you rub one finger up and down the middle of your
forehead when you were trying to remember some detail - noticed - well -
you.

> We did manage to have a conversation right?  In between what must have been
> the most subtle give and take of checking each other out?  I know we did,
> 'cause I liked your accent, your tone of voice.

LOL - yeah. But hey - we both clearly rule at subtle ....    and - likewise -
your accent's lovely - kinda glad you didn’t stay in NY long enough for that
to take.

> Now I'm grinning.  :D

Cool ;)

> We must always keep my ultimate goal in mind.  I shall rule the world and
> you can either be my slave or by my side.

Note to self : fill in henchman application form.

> Could be.  :-)  You were friendly and asked good questions and were polite
> even though you weren't interested in a job.  You still wanted to know about
> the programs, and you...well, you didn't just rush off.  You looked at me
> when you spoke.

You were by far the most interesting person I talked to all day.  I almost
wish I *did* want a job with KI - none of the UK operations really grabbed
me though, and, I don’t think I’d qualify for any of the US based ones, and I
need something long-ish term, you know?  Actually you do know - that would be
the conversation we were having while the subtle thing was going on ...

> I don't spend a whole lot of time thinking about you naked.  Or while I'm
> naked.

ok

> No, I'm not.  Because that comes real close to either playing mind games or
> being dishonest, and I said I wouldn't do that.  I don't spend *a lot* of
> time thinking about you naked, but I have.

Umm - I have no real idea what to say to that. I appreciate the candour. I
also suspect the view was probably better than the reality.

Ok : Question.  You have, in some general 'picture people naked so you don't
freak out while public speaking' sort of way, or me, specifically, for
whatever reason?.

> And I'll totally get it if I don't hear from you again, though I wouldn't be
> happy with myself.

Yeah - this is me ignoring you again ;p

> Now, moving on and hoping to God that you didn't just faint or die or
> something leaving the e-mail open where the  next person to the computer
> will read that.

Conscious, breathing, and not in the habit of wandering away from half read
emails - too curious to see what you have too say to wander off.

> > I was pretty much assuming it was a general thing - you
> > know - people are people, and clothes are just extras.
>
> That's mostly what I meant!
>
> Yay, one of us has a working brain.

Fancy writing to the uni to certify to that?

> So did I--wasn't allowed near Dad's--it was *his* thing, you know?

I'm getting this picture of your dad as being a bit of a hippie, wandering
feet sort of guy. Am I even in the right ball park?

> Nope, not a musical bone in my body.  :-)

I did recorder in junior school ....

> Too late.  Guilt by association--you fell into my trap and will share the
> blame when I'm in charge of the world.

You left off the muuhahahah evil laugh.

And I only take on the guilt when I put on the hench uniform, right?

> True and true.  It seems to take a lot to work of the courage to ask for
> even a simple dinner date.

You do the asking often? - Did? Whatever tense that should be.

> Actually that sounds great, even at three am--I'm starving.  Wonder what I
> have in the fridge?
>
> Lettuce, a bottle of Coke, two of water, and something in a plastic
> container that I'm not too sure about.  Huh.  Time to shop.

Yeah. And find a cafe for breakfast - which I guess you already did ... find
something good?

> I'm sure you'll be fine--cycle. But please eat something healthy.  Yes, I
> see the irony.

I was made out like a bandit last night - ran into Tesco just as they were
closing and picked up a *huge* steak violently reduced - and seeing as I've
managed to chip away at the filth while the others are away -
procrastination is a wonderful tool - I went full out - steak-en-croute,
carrot and potato and turnip chips, veggies - the full works - even dug out
a bottle of half decent wine [and the rest of it will still be in the
fridge, rather than a housemate - the novelty value!] .  Of course that does
nothing much for the 'not being a porker' element, but there's actual
vitamins and stuff!

You want me to start nagging *you*, take out guy?

> LOL! It's all in the plan.  Page three.

There’s a plan? I never got a plan!

> Maybe.  Who knows with mothers?  ;-)

Um - should I apologise for keep bringing up the family thing, seeing as it's
not exactly a happy zone?

> And yeah, I guess I'm meeting him Monday night--Janet's getting a
> bunch of people together for supper at a place near work, which as
> far as I can tell is just an obvious attempt to get us in the same room.  
> At least it's not a solo thing and I can bail early if I have to.

*sigh of relief* - That doesn’t sound *too* bad - at least - how subtle is
this Janet?

> Again, it was me being too tired and getting too wrapped up in it.  Sleep is
> a wonderful thing.  And I wouldn't have said no to a sort of hug.  :-)

Sleep is indeed a wonderful thing. And here : retroactive hug. Just in case
it comes in future, yeah?

> > Did I say thank you? For asking, and listening, and not just telling me to
> > grow up and get over myself? Because - thank you.
>
> You're welcome.  And I'm here to listen and tell you the truth anytime you
> need it.

Thank you

/stuck record.

> Okay, now there's where I would have offered the sort of hug.  I'm sorry
> you're hurting, Tom.  Wish I could make it better.

You are. Helping I mean. It's - it's good to be able to talk to someone who
gets it.

> > *What* x-rated stuff? You know something I don't?
>
> There are times in every man's life when an imagination is a wonderful
> thing.  Or a curse.  Take your pick.

You *really* want to know what comes up in the depths of my perverted mind?

It occurs that I may have phrased that badly.

> You know it!  Feeling very perky right now.  Too bad the rest of the world
> is asleep.

How’s the perk lasting?

> > [Nick Hornby moment : top ten films to watch when you're bored? ]
>
> 1) X-men

Top choice - I can’t wait for #2 - [there's another list moment top 5 actors
you wouldn’t kick out of bed. Alan Cumming's is on mine ;)]

> 2) Men in Black

Weirdly - I liked the sequel better.

> 6) Ladyhawk

I've never even heard of this one - enlighten me?

> 9) Rope

Nor this.

> 10) Silence of the Lambs.

God - really?  Hated it. Hated the books, hated the film, generally think
Anthony Hopkins is overrated ... [sods law says he's therefore on your list,
and you now hate me ...]

Matrix
X-Men
Blade Runner
Life of Brian
Star Wars - any of the original three
Shawshank Redemption
Richard III - the Ian McKellen one
Highlander
Mulan - and don't you dare laugh.
and - any other ancient western - the sort of thing they show on tv, and
you have only ever seen from 1/3 of the way through but they catch you up
regardless - love 'em.

Did you see Equilibrium? It’s only just out here, but - when that's out on
video, I think that'll be on my list too.

Right - going to get another 1000 words done before I'm aloud to check back
for a reply ...

Tom
*********
Remember : You are not a salmon.



To: Thomas Moorfield
From: Oliver Kurland
Sent:  Friday 12:03pm

Lunch time!  You'll be happy to know I'm having some sort of healthy
stuff--veggie pasta.

> > If I think of anything I'll let you know.  Give you the second set of
> > master plans for World domination?
>
> Umm - If they're your plans??? And I don’t have the super powers to steal
> them either. Sorry.

I'll try to come up with something else then.  ;-)

> It's definitely not meant to be this powdery crap in a paper cup, but :
> vending machine - I'll take what I can get.  It's before noon, it's still
> the holidays and I'm back at my station, plugging on with the
> dissertation. Go me.

Go you!  Put some enthusiasm in that.  And you should be proud of yourself.

> > Huh.  Apparently I ramble in the early hours.  Who knew?
>
> Champagne and early mornings - check   Sounds pretty cool - the
> 'having the whole world to yourself' thing.

It was neat.  :-)  Think it's better for my sleep cycle to be dreaming at
that hour though.

> > I'd tell you.  Right now I'm just feeling flattered that you noticed
> > anything about me.
>
> I noticed that - noticed the way you present stuff you know backwards and
> sideways, and the way you rub one finger up and down the middle of your
> forehead when you were trying to remember some detail - noticed - well -
> you.

Your smile is slightly crooked and you look to the left when you're
thinking.

> > We did manage to have a conversation right?  In between what must have
> > been the most subtle give and take of checking each other out?  I
> > know we did, 'cause I liked your accent, your tone of voice.
>
> LOL - yeah. But hey - we both clearly rule at subtle ....    and
> - likewise - your accent's lovely - kinda glad you didn’t stay in NY long
> enough for that to take.

You and me both. :-)

> Note to self : fill in henchman application form.

I have a great benefits package.

> > No, I'm not.  Because that comes real close to either playing mind games
> > or being dishonest, and I said I wouldn't do that.  I don't spend
> > *a lot* of time thinking about you naked, but I have.
>
> Umm - I have no real idea what to say to that. I appreciate the candour. I
> also suspect the view was probably better than the reality.

Don't know that for sure.

> Ok : Question.  You have, in some general 'picture people naked
> so you don't freak out while public speaking' sort of way, or me, specifically, for
> whatever reason?.

Christ.  Knew I should have just let that go.

Right.  Okay.  Deep breath.

I've thought about you.   Without your clothes.  With intent.  If you would
like more detail I invite you to use the other e-mail address I gave you.

> > And I'll totally get it if I don't hear from you again, though
> > I wouldn't be happy with myself.
>
> Yeah - this is me ignoring you again ;p

Still there?

> Conscious, breathing, and not in the habit of wandering away
> from half read emails - too curious to see what you have too say to wander off.

You know what curiosity will get you.  Lots of information.  :P

> > Yay, one of us has a working brain.
>
> Fancy writing to the uni to certify to that?

Sure. :-)

> > So did I--wasn't allowed near Dad's--it was *his* thing, you know?
>
> I'm getting this picture of your dad as being a bit of a hippie, wandering
> feet sort of guy. Am I even in the right ball park?

God, yes.  That's my dad.  Little flighty, very open, great soul.  Giving,
kind, passionate.

> > Nope, not a musical bone in my body.  :-)
>
> I did recorder in junior school ....

Bet that was cute. :-)

> > Too late.  Guilt by association--you fell into my trap and will
> > share the blame when I'm in charge of the world.
>
> You left off the muuhahahah evil laugh.
>
> And I only take on the guilt when I put on the hench uniform, right?

Sorry.  You know too much, I can't let you loose now.  The only thing left
to be decided is how much blame you get.  I mean credit.  Yeah, that's it.

> > True and true.  It seems to take a lot to work of the courage to ask for
> > even a simple dinner date.
>
> You do the asking often? - Did? Whatever tense that should be.

Nope.  Working my way up to it.

> > Lettuce, a bottle of Coke, two of water, and something in a plastic
> > container that I'm not too sure about.  Huh.  Time to shop.
>
> Yeah. And find a cafe for breakfast - which I guess you already
> did ... find something good?

All night place a few blocks from here does a mean beef sandwich at four in
the morning.

> > I'm sure you'll be fine--cycle. But please eat something
> > healthy.  Yes, I see the irony.
>
> I was made out like a bandit last night - ran into Tesco just as they were
> closing and picked up a *huge* steak violently reduced - and
> seeing as I've managed to chip away at the filth while the others are away -
> procrastination is a wonderful tool - I went full out - steak-en-croute,
> carrot and potato and turnip chips, veggies - the full works -
> even dug out a bottle of half decent wine [and the rest of it will still be in the
> fridge, rather than a housemate - the novelty value!] .  Of course
> that does nothing much for the 'not being a porker' element, but there's actual
> vitamins and stuff!

You are *so* cooking for me.  Henchman or not.

> You want me to start nagging *you*, take out guy?

I'll stop at the grocery store on my way home.  Promise.  And I won't even
skip the produce section this time.

> > LOL! It's all in the plan.  Page three.
>
> There’s a plan? I never got a plan!

That's because it's *my* plan.  Page four is all about.....never mind.  That
would be telling.  Too much information and you'll be in charge when I take
over.

> > Maybe.  Who knows with mothers?  ;-)
>
> Um - should I apologise for keep bringing up the family thing,
> seeing as it's not exactly a happy zone?

Nope, that is really an okay topic.  Had a few years to deal with it, and my
Dad's cool.

> > And yeah, I guess I'm meeting him Monday night--Janet's getting
> > a bunch of people together for supper at a
> > place near work, which as far as I can tell is just an obvious
> > attempt to get us in the same room.  At least it's not a solo thing and
> > I can bail early if I have to.
>
> *sigh of relief* - That doesn’t sound *too* bad - at least - how subtle is
> this Janet?

Not very, but at least she's told me his name.  Dave, apparently, works for
one of the manufacturing divisions.  That's the extent of my knowledge.

Maybe I'll skip it.  I dunno.

> Sleep is indeed a wonderful thing. And here : retroactive hug.
> Just in case it comes in future, yeah?

Thanks, Tom.  That made me smile.  Actually, I smile a lot reading your
e-mails.  God, that sounds sappy. It's true though.

> You are. Helping I mean. It's - it's good to be able to talk to
> someone who gets it.

Well, good.

> > > *What* x-rated stuff? You know something I don't?
> >
> > There are times in every man's life when an imagination is a wonderful
> > thing.  Or a curse.  Take your pick.
>
> You *really* want to know what comes up in the depths of my
> perverted mind?
>
> It occurs that I may have phrased that badly.

Heh.  And here's where I invite you to shock me.  I doubt very much if
you're perverted at all.

> > You know it!  Feeling very perky right now.  Too bad the rest
> > of the world is asleep.
>
> How’s the perk lasting?

Perk is in full swing.  I've had three people today ask me if they could
have whatever it is I'm on.  :-)  I told them to go home and sleep for
twelve hours, send an e-mail to London, and eat at a diner before going to
work three hours early.

Hey, I get to go home early then!  On a Friday!  Bonus.

Not that there's anything to do at home, but maybe I can get some climbing
in at the gym.  Hmm.  That sounds like a plan.  Climb, swim, head home to
read something cheap, trashy and vaguely pornographic.

What a life.  Yeesh.

> > > [Nick Hornby moment : top ten films to watch when you're bored? ]
> >
> > 1) X-men
>
> Top choice - I can’t wait for #2 - [there's another list moment
> top 5 actors you wouldn’t kick out of bed. Alan Cumming's is on mine ;)]

Hugh Jackman.  Rar.

> > 2) Men in Black
>
> Weirdly - I liked the sequel better.

I laughed a lot at the sequel but it just felt like it was made to bring
Tommy Lee Jones back for the third one.

> > 6) Ladyhawk
>
> I've never even heard of this one - enlighten me?

Came out like twenty years ago. Michelle Pfeiffer, Rutger Hauer (or however
the hell that's spelled) Matthew Broderick when he was a young 'un.  MP and
RH are cursed--he's a man by day, a wolf by night, she's a hawk by day and a
woman at night.  They change at sunset and sunrise, always together, but
always apart.  It's fantasy and silly and wildly romantic.  It's my secret
shame, along with The Princess Bride.

> > 9) Rope
>
> Nor this.

Hitchcock, shot in real time.  Well, I assume they shot it like a regular
movie, but the action takes place in real time.  Also, it takes place in one
room, like a play.  Very cool.  Murder mystery, black and white.

> > 10) Silence of the Lambs.
>
> God - really?  Hated it. Hated the books, hated the film, generally think
> Anthony Hopkins is overrated ... [sods law says he's therefore on
> your list, and you now hate me ...]

Nah, he's okay, I really liked Jodie Foster in this one.  HATED Hannibal, the
sequel--both the book and the movie.

> Life of Brian

Knew I forgot one.

> Star Wars - any of the original three

Oh yeah, for sure.

> Shawshank Redemption

God, another one.  Loved this movie.  Liked the Green Mile, too.

> Mulan - and don't you dare laugh.

Princess Bride.  I *can't* laugh.

> Did you see Equilibrium? It’s only just out here, but - when that's out on
> video, I think that'll be on my list too.

Not yet.  I'll look for it.  :-)

> Right - going to get another 1000 words done before I'm aloud to
> check back for a reply ..

Replied!  Hope you got lots done.

Now, back to work, then the gym etc before *I* check for a reply.

Oliver



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